Week 2: Ballads and Barcarolles 🎼🛶

Welcome to the Main Thread for the second week of "Song and Dance" practice challenge! 

  1. Choose a piece that is inspired or transcribed from a song or a dance. It could be a lively south-american danza, a passionate tango, a serene romantic lied, or a poignant aria transcribed for the guitar. You're welcome to explore pieces from unfamiliar composers or challenge yourself with a complex work. 🎼

  2. Commit to daily practice and share your journey with the community. Aim to practice every day and upload at least two videos each week to illustrate your progress. This will not only help you stay committed and encouraged but will also allow you to share your musical voyage with our tonebase family. 🎥

  3. Share your favorite piece or recording that embodies the theme of "Song and Dance." Your submission will serve as an inspiration to others and create a vibrant pool of potential pieces for other members to delve into. 🎧

↓ Happy Sharing! ↓

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    • Jack Stewart
    • Retired
    • Jack_Stewart
    • 11 mths ago
    • Reported - view

    Rameau Allemande II 1706 Finally

    I almost got this in the first week>

    This is a piece that I started during the Transcription Challenge but couldn't get a passable recording of it. I feel this is pretty decent (requisite blunders not withstanding). I even think my tone is starting to settle in. Learning to play nailless has been a humbling (re: discouraging) experience. It is still not where I want it to be or, even where it was when I was using nails, but at least I am not completely embarrassed by it. (I know, you are probably thinking; 'Really? What would it take to make you feel embarrassed?')

    Most of the places where I stumbled are generally playable for me so I am not as critical of them. However, I still have difficulty in the higher range, though there is definite improvement.

    Oh yes. I'd like to give credit to my wife for her percussion performance.

    Like 11
      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Jack Stewart Very nice, Jack. It definitely looks challenging to play. (Is it your own arrangement?) I think your tone is sounding quite good now, even if there is room for improvement. (Btw, only when your wife's incidental percussion is the highlight of the performance need you feel any embarrassment. Not happening yet, but watch out - I think she's improving!)

      Like
      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Jack Stewart I know what you mean about having difficulty 'locating' the fingers, Jack. I definitely experienced that when I first went 'nail-less'. But after a while this ceased to be a problem. Have you heard of that weird experiment where people were given eyewear that made everything appear upside down? Apparently after a few days of utter disorientation, everything began to seem right-side-up. Their brains had somehow adapted. I think something analogous to that happens here as well. (And, as far as I'm concerned, not having to worry about nail shape - not to mention 'reverse ramps' (whatever those are) - is a great big 'plus'!)

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    • Jack Stewart I know what you mean with «to locate», I have a similar problem with some strings when I restring my guitar 😂

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    • Jack Stewart A lovely piece—new to me .  So many ornaments- very French!  Well done!

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    • Jack Stewart So why are you going nailless?  In a pinch I have used “ nail powder” at my local salon. It always destroys the nail bed and has taken me as long as 6 months to bring back healthy nails. But they do come back. Now if I need to fix a broken nail I ask them for the smallest possible repair.  And I tend to them almost daily with micro mesh up to 12000.

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      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Marilyn Blodget That reminds me of another advantage of eschewing nails - no need for ultra-fine grade sanding! Clippers are all you need, and in a pinch, even teeth will do! 😂

      Like
    • David Krupka I guess it's technique then since a couple of months ago I had to cut off my nails and I could barely get a sound out of it without snapping the strings. Maybe someday I'll put the effort in to figure it out since it would be really nice not to have to mess with them like you mentioned. 

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      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Steve Price The attack (as I do it, at least) is definitely quite different than what I did when I played with nails. It feels more like 'plucking' than, say, 'brushing' the strings. I would say the attack begins lower on the string when there's no nail involved.

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    • Jack Stewart Very nice and great progress. As always, love your ornamentation and your nailless tone is sounding good.  

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      • Jack Stewart
      • Retired
      • Jack_Stewart
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      David Krupka Thanks David. It is my own transcription though the original texture didn't require too many adjustments. I have a transcription by Andrew Bellows that was much simpler but it had been transposed to e min. I have ambitions of working up most of the suite and the rest of the suite works in a min. This also sounds better in the higher register (well, it has potential for sending better.) This has proven to be quite difficult for me, though getting used to nailless is smoothing that out a bit.

      BTW I have found that nailless is generally less volume, at least initially. I suspect it has to do with the stiffness of the nail creates a crisper sound than the softness of flesh. Once I developed callouses I have less problem with volume.

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      • Jack Stewart
      • Retired
      • Jack_Stewart
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Marilyn Blodget Thanks Marilyn. 
      I do feel this piece (and Rameau in general) takes elaborate ornaments well. I suspect I will make adjustments to them as I get a better grasp of performing it.

      As to going w/o nails I have done so 'kicking and screaming'. My nails have deteriorated pretty severely over the last several years. I changed to glue on fakes but found they really damaged my nails even more. I then went to adhesive tabs and found them to be much better. They would only stay on for 2-4 days but I could remove the adhesive and reuse the nails so I thought that would work. However, they started falling off more frequently - sometimes several times in one practice session. So I decided to go w/o. I am still hoping my nails recover enough to return to some form of nails but we'll see.

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      • Jack Stewart
      • Retired
      • Jack_Stewart
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Dale Needles Thanks Dale. Hopefully I am getting a grasp of the technique.

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      • don
      • don.2
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Jack Stewart somehow I read it as I gave credit card to my wife…:-)

      I remember this piece from the challenge before. can already tell that is much better and it is really coming along nicely now. 

      Like
    • Jack Stewart Your sound without nails is fine, but I know I would be kicking and screaming without them. I used and replaced “ salon nails” on damaged fingers for about 9 months.  My nails were so thin and weak when I decided enough is enough, that I just needed to give them time to grow out.  Having to replace fake nails every few days is a real bother.  I’ve usually had a problem with only one nail at a time.  Now I go to my salon at the first sign of a tear, and ask them for the smallest possible repair. I do not care what it looks like.  I totally understand the geography problem of going nailless.  But, Sor preferred no nails, so you’re in good company.

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      • Jack Stewart
      • Retired
      • Jack_Stewart
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      don Thanks Don. 

      Note; she already has the credit card.😢

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      • Wainull
      • Wai_Ng
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Jack Stewart Your sound is really good, Jack! If you didn't mention it, I never would have guessed that you were playing nailless, and the percussion accompaniment was spot on as well, you should consider having her join your recordings more often. 😀

      Like
      • Jack Stewart
      • Retired
      • Jack_Stewart
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Wai Thanks Wai. It is good to hear that my sound has improved w/o nails. I am getting more acquainted with how to control the use of flesh (and new calluses).

      My wife wields a mean whisk.🙂

      Like 1
    • Jack Stewart my main concern with nailless is the lack of possible sound colours, at least for my style of playing 🤔

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      • Jack Stewart
      • Retired
      • Jack_Stewart
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Blaise Laflamme That is one of my concerns as well. I also find my playing is slower w/o than with nails, but that has improved over the last month so that might even out in the end. Though concerns are somewhat moot for me at this point since my nails are so poor and I am not having any success w/ fakes.😢

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      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Blaise Laflamme You're probably right about that, and indeed that might be the reason most players today use nails. My own feeling is that the tonal variety often called for in modern repertoire is generally out of place in music written before (about) 1900, which is what I mostly play. 

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    • Jack Stewart hmmm... yeah with more surface and thickness (the tip of the finger) I fear the result will always be slower. Did you tried the RC nail kit? my friend got decent results with it... https://www.stringsbymail.com/rc-strings-nail-kit-nk100-13993.html

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    • David Krupka quite possible, if one stick with a particular style or period or even a romantic guitar or a lute that could simplify the need and technique. But speaking for myself I would have an hard time in the short-medium term without nails, I'll have to be creative! 😅

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      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Jack Stewart I also used to think speed was an issue for nail-less playing, but someone like Paul O'dette can 'shred' like nobody's business. (And I suspect 'nail-less' players of the past, like Sor and Carcassi, could as well!) Assuming velocity is governed primarily by the  movement of the fingers, it is not clear what bearing the presence of absence of nails should have on it. (For myself, I couldn't play fast with nails, and I still can't play fast, now that I no longer have them! 😪)

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    • Jack Stewart it’s so beautiful Jack. Such a good transcription and fantastic ornamentation. 

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      • David Krupka
      • Amateur guitarist/lutenist
      • David_Krupka
      • 11 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Jack Stewart Blaise Laflamme I came across a short interview (in print) with Virginia Luque (Segovia's last student, apparently) who, it turns out, plays without nails. She definitely has no difficulty achieving great velocity, and her tonal palette seems no less broad than that of other well known concert guitarists. The two videos preceding the interview are well worth watching. (The second is audio only, with an explanatory text.)

      https://rmclassicalguitar.com/interviews/virginia-luque/

      Like 1
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